RWBY & RT General Discussion Thread (V1)

Matrix Dragon

Well-known member
It's a messy one, to say the least. Back in the 80s, the G1 cartoon had the Decepticons as the military bots that decided to rule the world with an iron fist, and the Autobots were the civilians alt-mode bots that were forced to fight back. The G1 comics had the Decepticons as one of dozens of nations on Cybertron that decided to conquer the world, with the Autobots simply one of the other nations that managed to fight back to some extent.

In the 2000s, especially with Transformers Prime and the IDW comics, they went with a more consistent approach, in that Cybertron had a very repressive caste system, with everyone having their assigned places in society. The IDW comics had religious beliefs called Functionism that insisted your alt-mode dictated your role in society. And when you transformed into mining tools or a vacuum cleaner... In these continuities, Orion Pax and Megatron both initially played a role in taking a stand against a broken system. Megatron was a miner/gladiator, while Orion was a simple archivist/low ranking cop. The difference was that Orion believed the system could be reformed, while Megatron eventually decided it needed to be torn down and rebuilt from scratch.

I've always been troubled with this approach to some extent, especially since in this day and age, portraying those that are willing to use violence against a broken system as 'falling into endless violence' strikes me as a troublesome attitude that can easily be twisted to dismiss protests.

Amusingly, RWBY actually does portray it somewhat better there, given how Blake's arc in the first five volumes had her dealing with a violent maniac that would steal the movement to satisfy his murder-boner, and yet she's still willing to take up arms against a corrupt government at the end of volume 7, after giving it so many chances to prove her wrong.

That said, with the WFC continuity here...
We often see Megatron hesitating at moral boundaries, considering them, then proceeding onward regardless. His orders to Shockwave regarding Magnus, then later murdering him, having the virus devastate the planetary networks despite Soundwaves warnings of the damage it would cause to the Decepticons... I can't help but think of Adam once again, with Jetfire and Impactor as something of the Blake of the situation.

As for why RWBY fandom makes noise about such things compared to the TF fandom? Too many people made their online reputations hating everything in this show and complaining about it no matter how illogical they might be. Transformers fans have a long history of remembering it's a show about kids toys, and a few... interesting examples of people that treat it too seriously.
 

Zam

Well-known member
Taking no prisoners XD

Oh Coco. You need to get a girlfriend or get out of Vacuo. Cuz that thirst is real. :ROFLMAO:
Hahahahaha XD

Coco is crawling through a parched desert in more ways than one XD

]Well I finished binge watching this yesterday. Would like to echo most of your comments. Though I'd also like to add that just like the last cg animated Transformers show I watched the series is a bit hard to follow with it's decades of continuity and expanding cast leading to a very information dense story that kind of just assumes that everyone is familiar with a lot of these characters already.

Something more interesting I noticed was that once again Rooster Teeth found themselves embroiled in making a cg animated show that has a racism subplot with some very uncomfortable implications... Except this time nobody gives a shit because from what I can tell this has long been part of Transformers canon so everyone gives it a free pass in a way they don't with RWBY.

I mean I'm not super familiar with Transformers but from what I can remember from prior to watching this show Megatron has been a fallen rebel for a long time in Transformers canon. With this show however I became a lot more familiar with just what that meant.

Which was apparently that Megatron and the Decepticons were a literal slave race who Optimus Prime and some Big Good called Alpha Trion helped rescue from their oppressors by starting a rebellion, only for Megatron to betray his mentor and savior Alpha Trion to make himself dictator for life and then eventually deciding to commit genocide on all the white people Autobots who refused to join him.

I mean, maybe there's some context I'm missing out on but from what I've seen here Transformers Canon is way more

than anything Rooster Teeth has come up with on it's own. Yet I've never seen the same kind of outrage materialize over the much more widely known and mainstream Transformers than I have over RWBY.

I'm glad you hear your enjoyed it! And fair take there, I do wish there had been an episode or two more for it to breath a little XD

I don't know enough about the Transformers lore on that front to really say, but that is an interesting avenue of comparison, kudos there.

I actually found myself looking in the mirror like "Would I normally be comfortable with this kind of plot?" And yeah it makes it clear a lot of the outrage in RWBY may be rather selective in nature.
Also good use of Weiss image.

It's a messy one, to say the least. Back in the 80s, the G1 cartoon had the Decepticons as the military bots that decided to rule the world with an iron fist, and the Autobots were the civilians alt-mode bots that were forced to fight back. The G1 comics had the Decepticons as one of dozens of nations on Cybertron that decided to conquer the world, with the Autobots simply one of the other nations that managed to fight back to some extent.

In the 2000s, especially with Transformers Prime and the IDW comics, they went with a more consistent approach, in that Cybertron had a very repressive caste system, with everyone having their assigned places in society. The IDW comics had religious beliefs called Functionism that insisted your alt-mode dictated your role in society. And when you transformed into mining tools or a vacuum cleaner... In these continuities, Orion Pax and Megatron both initially played a role in taking a stand against a broken system. Megatron was a miner/gladiator, while Orion was a simple archivist/low ranking cop. The difference was that Orion believed the system could be reformed, while Megatron eventually decided it needed to be torn down and rebuilt from scratch.

I've always been troubled with this approach to some extent, especially since in this day and age, portraying those that are willing to use violence against a broken system as 'falling into endless violence' strikes me as a troublesome attitude that can easily be twisted to dismiss protests.
Wow you are certainly well informed, thanks so much for sharing!

And yeah I definitely find it a rather sus approach in the broad terms, even more with Orian being a cop :/
Amusingly, RWBY actually does portray it somewhat better there, given how Blake's arc in the first five volumes had her dealing with a violent maniac that would steal the movement to satisfy his murder-boner, and yet she's still willing to take up arms against a corrupt government at the end of volume 7, after giving it so many chances to prove her wrong.

That said, with the WFC continuity here...

[/spoiler]
We often see Megatron hesitating at moral boundaries, considering them, then proceeding onward regardless. His orders to Shockwave regarding Magnus, then later murdering him, having the virus devastate the planetary networks despite Soundwaves warnings of the damage it would cause to the Decepticons... I can't help but think of Adam once again, with Jetfire and Impactor as something of the Blake of the situation.

As for why RWBY fandom makes noise about such things compared to the TF fandom? Too many people made their online reputations hating everything in this show and complaining about it no matter how illogical they might be. Transformers fans have a long history of remembering it's a show about kids toys, and a few... interesting examples of people that treat it too seriously.
That is an amusing thing, right from V2 RWBY and co were fine with going around the law to get a job done and will stand against a government in open defiance in V7 when necessary, I like it!

That was one thing I did appreciate, it sorta ties in with what I'd noted about how the war has basically degraded everyone, optimus is clinging to a sort of manic, radical faith, Megatron wants to hold onto a sense of honor he once had but keeps compromising himself & eventually just gives in, but you get a sense in his first meeting with Optimus he's not exactly... Happy with himself. Even as he marches further and further down the slippery slope of immorality and callous disregard for even those he claimed to fight for.

Excellent point there, I am reminded of something a movie reviewer I like (MovieBob) noted about "Worst comics ever" and that he thinks the hate against certain not great or goofy story decisions in recent comics would be no worse than it was when he was growing up... If not for the rage magnification machine that is the internet that lets loud voices have a platform to rally and organize rage & keep it stoked, while beforehand it'd mostly be reserved to some snippy letters or just not buying the next issue ETC.
 

Matrix Dragon

Well-known member
Wow you are certainly well informed, thanks so much for sharing!

I've been a transformers fan since 1986. I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Carnage in C-Minor. Kiss Players. The Beast Within. Dreamwave, corporate criminals, (Although I repeat myself) a real-life legal war that raged for decades, death threats, TFW2005... The TF fandom has been through so much. We've had decades to work out our shit, and you'll still find loonies hiding in the corners. By that standard, RWBY is so much younger, but also a child of the internet era and everything that goes with it. There's a reason I'm more than happy to poke the trolls for a laugh. I've seen worse.

Excellent point there, I am reminded of something a movie reviewer I like (MovieBob) noted about "Worst comics ever" and that he thinks the hate against certain not great or goofy story decisions in recent comics would be no worse than it was when he was growing up... If not for the rage magnification machine that is the internet that lets loud voices have a platform to rally and organize rage & keep it stoked, while beforehand it'd mostly be reserved to some snippy letters or just not buying the next issue ETC.

No no, DC and Marvel over the past twenty years deserve scorn for so many of their creative choices. There's good reasons the comic industry is dying a slow, painful death, and while many of them are corporate based (The discussions I've had with my local comic store owner about trying to do business with suppliers is the stuff of nightmares), when creative decisions are things like 'let's make Captain America an actual Nazi and drag it out for years', at least some writers need a stern talking to :)
 

Zam

Well-known member
I've been a transformers fan since 1986. I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Carnage in C-Minor. Kiss Players. The Beast Within. Dreamwave, corporate criminals, (Although I repeat myself) a real-life legal war that raged for decades, death threats, TFW2005... The TF fandom has been through so much. We've had decades to work out our shit, and you'll still find loonies hiding in the corners. By that standard, RWBY is so much younger, but also a child of the internet era and everything that goes with it. There's a reason I'm more than happy to poke the trolls for a laugh. I've seen worse.
(Blinks wildly) I feel like I just had forty odd years of drama flashed before my eyes on the side of a truck and then disappear down a street and fading into the ether XD

No no, DC and Marvel over the past twenty years deserve scorn for so many of their creative choices. There's good reasons the comic industry is dying a slow, painful death, and while many of them are corporate based (The discussions I've had with my local comic store owner about trying to do business with suppliers is the stuff of nightmares), when creative decisions are things like 'let's make Captain America an actual Nazi and drag it out for years', at least some writers need a stern talking to :)
Oh sorry for being unclear, he wasn't saying the stories shouldn't have been criticized, just that the many of the modern one's being torn down weren't worse than past bad ideas (This was before Captain Hyrda for context) but that the internet gave the impression they were.
 

Matrix Dragon

Well-known member
(Blinks wildly) I feel like I just had forty odd years of drama flashed before my eyes on the side of a truck and then disappear down a street and fading into the ether XD

Was it a big red truck by any chance? :p

Oh sorry for being unclear, he wasn't saying the stories shouldn't have been criticized, just that the many of the modern one's being torn down weren't worse than past bad ideas (This was before Captain Hyrda for context) but that the internet gave the impression they were.

Eh, I'm a little mixed even on that. I mean, a lot of older comics were at least willing to admit they were being silly. These days there's a lot of writers that insist that it is all SERIOUS BUSINESS. Bits like Yangs glee at getting a new bike in the V8 teaser would be dismissed because SERIOUS BUSINESS.
 

Zam

Well-known member
Was it a big red truck by any chance? :p
Something like that, had a great soundtrack playing though ;)

Eh, I'm a little mixed even on that. I mean, a lot of older comics were at least willing to admit they were being silly. These days there's a lot of writers that insist that it is all SERIOUS BUSINESS. Bits like Yangs glee at getting a new bike in the V8 teaser would be dismissed because SERIOUS BUSINESS.
That's a fair take, he likely explains it better than I can, though even then you might not agree and fair enough XD (Though amusingly said reviewer is also irked by modern comics & adult comics fans demanding SERIOUS BUSINESS all the time)

Also gosh people whining about that confuses me so much, RWBY is hope punk, & even if not, a relentlessly depressing slog is not something I'd actually want to watch, people find humor and small flickering signs to hope and laugh as a coping mechanism ya know?

Also an interesting bit of Ironwood meta:
 
https://jula-psd.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F625396294415974400 link


The soundtrack was really a kick in the muse for a lot of artists it seems.


And Oscar continues to be a goldmine for hilarious jokes.


A good breakdown of Ruby's character (or one aspect of it at least).


We're here to discuss news, analyse characters, chat about episodes and generally engage with the series and maybe some other RT products to, I've got a strong interest in Recorded by Arizal for instance ;)
Speaking of which, there is a new Log out.

I'm not crying. You're crying! 😭
 

Zam

Well-known member
Indeed it was! I love that pic by the way :D

Hahaha, poor kid's so stressed, I love it! XD

An excellent piece, honestly it amazes me how someone could miss it but then I remember the kind of reviewer we're talking about (Rolls eyes)

Speaking of which, there is a new Log out.
I'm not crying. You're crying! 😭
I loved the scenery of this episode, the world building, and that ending, dang you RT you are too good at toying with my feels!
 

Matrix Dragon

Well-known member
I love that moment with Ruby and Blake, and remain convinced that was the moment she chose to try and team up with her and Yang.

On another note, I just came across a comment from someone who said they dropped it after volume 3 proved only Monty knew how to animate a fight scene, and I had to laugh. Anyone remember the time they made a throwaway gag of Sun and Neptune stopping for noodles? Because Monty forgot they were supposed to be fighting? There's a reason I don't usually include that in Suns 'pure of heart, dumb of ass' list. :)
 
  • Wow
Reactions: Zam

Zam

Well-known member
Also these takes are great XD

Blake is dapper
I never noticed this
Blake being a dramatic royal

I love that moment with Ruby and Blake, and remain convinced that was the moment she chose to try and team up with her and Yang.
Its an excellent scene that I feel does a great job summing up Ruby's character, she's not naive to the fact the world is a harsh and unpleasant place, but rather than let that change her, she wants to do what she can to change the world. Its neither ill informed cos she's not ignorant, nor overly arrogant in a "Only I can fix the world way" and its an attitude she's carried through continually through the series. This is why I view Ruby as a paragon and is hopepunk.

On another note, I just came across a comment from someone who said they dropped it after volume 3 proved only Monty knew how to animate a fight scene, and I had to laugh. Anyone remember the time they made a throwaway gag of Sun and Neptune stopping for noodles? Because Monty forgot they were supposed to be fighting? There's a reason I don't usually include that in Suns 'pure of heart, dumb of ass' list. :)
Gosh world, please spare me from these cultish creeps whom worship at the alter of a man they did not know.

Also wow, I didn't know that I thought they just realized they didn't have the time to include them all.
 

Matrix Dragon

Well-known member
Its an excellent scene that I feel does a great job summing up Ruby's character, she's not naive to the fact the world is a harsh and unpleasant place, but rather than let that change her, she wants to do what she can to change the world. Its neither ill informed cos she's not ignorant, nor overly arrogant in a "Only I can fix the world way" and its an attitude she's carried through continually through the series. This is why I view Ruby as a paragon and is hopepunk.

It's like her reply to Ozpins question in the first ep. "You want to hunt monsters." "I want to help people."

Ruby is no stranger to tragedy. Ravens disappearance, Summers death, Tais depression, Qrows drinking problem, the fact Yang had to grow up so fast... Emerald dismissing her as naive at the start of volume 3 is a sign of that character not getting it, not a word of God.


Also wow, I didn't know that I thought they just realized they didn't have the time to include them all.

It's what happens when stuff is rush animated by one man with no storyboards. Ruby was supposed to be explaining Yang's semblance to Sun, not Blake.
 

Zam

Well-known member
It's like her reply to Ozpins question in the first ep. "You want to hunt monsters." "I want to help people."

Ruby is no stranger to tragedy. Ravens disappearance, Summers death, Tais depression, Qrows drinking problem, the fact Yang had to grow up so fast... Emerald dismissing her as naive at the start of volume 3 is a sign of that character not getting it, not a word of God.
Ooh excellent point there, very well put!

Yuup, all of this, and its so wild/frustrating that people take Emerald's dismissal seriously; like villains in that scenario are basically always meant to be wrong ya know? But then it seems to be part of a wider and more prevalent reaction, sorta like how people wanted Aang to murder Ozai, like I have my issues with Avatar, but with hindsight and maturity, Aang having a flat arc mostly centered on maturing how he interacted with the world but not changing his world view & keeping true to his cultures principles & his own against the embodiment of the one who enacted genocide against them... Yeah, that works.

It's what happens when stuff is rush animated by one man with no storyboards. Ruby was supposed to be explaining Yang's semblance to Sun, not Blake.
I'd heard it was Blake explaining it to Neptune I must be ill informed XD

Nut yeah, so glad they're not doing the episodes down to the last minute now, makes for much smoother writing.

Also speaking of information, who wants to guess what kinda Scorpion Tyrian is based off?
 

Matrix Dragon

Well-known member
sorta like how people wanted Aang to murder Ozai, like I have my issues with Avatar, but with hindsight and maturity, Aang having a flat arc mostly centered on maturing how he interacted with the world but not changing his world view & keeping true to his cultures principles & his own against the embodiment of the one who enacted genocide against them... Yeah, that works.

The fun part there is that it's often occurred to me that killing him would have been more merciful from Ozais twisted perspective. Instead, he spent the rest of his life powerless, watching while Zuko rebuilt the Fire Kingdom into something decent.
 

Zam

Well-known member
Also on my "Can Ruby de-materialize other stuff into rose petals" question/idea, its partially asked cos while I could see a person's Aura rejecting such a thing if Ruby tried to de-materialize their weapon, I wonder if she could do it to say a blunt or bladed object held by a Grimm or in Cinder's grimm arm?

The fun part there is that it's often occurred to me that killing him would have been more merciful from Ozais twisted perspective. Instead, he spent the rest of his life powerless, watching while Zuko rebuilt the Fire Kingdom into something decent.
That is pretty hilarious XD

Ozai: How could you do something so cruel to me!?
Aang:... It wasn't... About you?
 

Matrix Dragon

Well-known member
I'd heard it was Blake explaining it to Neptune I must be ill informed XD

I've heard both, but given they had Ruby say it in the ep, I go with that one. Although making it clear Blake knows her teammates semblance would be hilarious, given I've seen people use that against her.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Zam

Zam

Well-known member
Rose Garden is not a favored ship of mine but this oneshot comic is hilarious and you should all go read it.


Also
I'm very much down with the idea of Yang painting her new bike like she did with her arm and I can recognize that this is quite good art. But in the actual show I want her to pick stronger colors that really makes the bike pop.



-looks around- Its very neon in here. I'm expecting more cat girls.


Also hiiiiii, most of you should know who I am.
Let me oblige:
giphy.gif




Hello. And yes, your reputation does indeed precede you. ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Zam

Matrix Dragon

Well-known member
Top