Red-Brown Worries

Comrade Sophia

Technoschizic Militia Goth
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https://medium.com/@petersoeller/the-rightwing-of-the-dsa-left-5fd38f265367
https://medium.com/@petersoeller/deplorables-for-bernie-part-ii-de1f5799831c
https://medium.com/@tamaravelasquez...-no-its-not-what-you-think-it-is-cd26675eee5d

So a friend of mine posted this to my discord and I don't agree with all the points made unreservedly, but I thought it a pretty good subject to discuss. This is one of the things I'm seeing in a lot of spaces full of people being opened up to Leftist ideas is the infusion of people who appropriate the arguments of nativist reactionaries thinking it can lead to anything but reactionary attitudes. This is worrying to me as I find generally it's the most oppressed classes whom real socialism and communism most often appeals to. I find people who are on the out with society as it exists now are the most susceptible to radicalization, both left- and right-wing. There's a reason why every trans woman being a member of the Maoist Red Guard or an Anarchist Bomb Thrower have become a meme inside the trans community.

This isn't to say Left-Right radicalization is equivalent, I don't see being radical as bad from outside a liberal framework of thought, I do recognize that all views outside the narrow frame society defines for us is "radical". I do have an issue with for example LibFems and Rainbow Capitalists. I'm more than happy to criticize those and recognize how they ignore the systemic issues of capitalism which makes it impossible to resolve the issues faced by both women and queer people due to the way capitalism incentivizes the marginalization of these as groups, the same holds true of ethnic minorities but I want to leave room for someone with personal experience in this matter to interject their own concerns.

However, I think it's important for us to recognize the inherent danger of many of the "Anti-IDpol" Left and how they very easily slot into a reactionary worldview.
 

Cassiel

New member
We need to work better to create a movement that embraces identity politics in a positive way. I feel like the identity politics of misery just generate reactionary behavior - on all sides.

The right drags together a big tent of people but does so by suppressing their distinct identities. We can't do the same. Some people think the answer is to create broader 'class' distinctions (workers of the world unite) but I think this tends to lead to the erasure of the problems of smaller groups within the broader class. The opposite, creating a race to the bottom, in which it 'pays' to be the most miserable and oppressed, creates a dog-eat-dog circular firing squad. We need to embrace both the diversity of the left and its varied members, but also embrace the fact that we are all different and our problems are not equal or the same.

And we need to do that in a way that doesn't itself exclude. Instead of mutual reinforcement, it feels like the embrace of diversity too often just turns into something that's not building up, it's tearing down.
 

Beatufiuldawn

New member
I concur with this because it is not hard to go from a class-reductionist view of socialism to become a full on strasserite. Plus it's not surprising the edgelord left and the alt-right intersect. Now that I think about it, Chapo naming its' fanbase after a group of Turkish neo-fascists is a red flag.
 

Comrade Sophia

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Beatufiuldawn said:
I concur with this because it is not hard to go from a class-reductionist view of socialism to become a full on strasserite. Plus it's not surprising the edgelord left and the alt-right intersect. Now that I think about it, Chapo naming its' fanbase after a group of Turkish neo-fascists is a red flag.

Hmmm... will have to ask Will about that next time I talk to him.
 

Comrade Sophia

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Beatufiuldawn said:
I concur with this because it is not hard to go from a class-reductionist view of socialism to become a full on strasserite. Plus it's not surprising the edgelord left and the alt-right intersect. Now that I think about it, Chapo naming its' fanbase after a group of Turkish neo-fascists is a red flag.

Oh according to Will it's not a term of endearment it's because they're cringingly edgy and riffing on The Young Turks.

BTW Will agrees with my assessment most chapo fans are liberals LARPing as Soviet revolutionaries to own the Cons. He self-admittedly spends more time in one of the discords I moderate than he does the Chapo one. He also got banned from r/chapotraphouse2 for not being tankie enough.
 

Beatufiuldawn

New member
Comrade?Sophia said:
Oh according to Will it's not a term of endearment it's because they're cringingly edgy and riffing on The Young Turks.

BTW Will agrees with my assessment most chapo fans are liberals LARPing as Soviet revolutionaries to own the Cons. He self-admittedly spends more time in one of the discords I moderate than he does the Chapo one. He also got banned from r/chapotraphouse2 for not being tankie enough.

Oh wow what a small world then. That makes a lot of sense tbh.
 

Beatufiuldawn

New member
I definitely believe that Adolph Reed is r/stupidpol's token black intellectual in that it's to show that they're not racist but black lives matter is "liberal bullshit."
 

Abbazorkzog

New member
Not sure I buy this as a legitimate concern (the argument proposed in the source material not the OP's response to it). It may seem convincing, but due to the inordinate amount of bullshit that has cascaded from the mouths of the Theocratic-Imperialist establishment in the US about 'sOcIaLiSm' in the past... welll... since before I was even born... and looking at the disproportionately right-heavy incriminating evidence:

Ku Klux Klan
Neo-Nazism in the United States
Racism in the United States
Confederate States of America
Jim Crow laws
South Bloc
Post-Reconstruction Disenfranchisement
American Nazi Party
U.S. National Socialist Movement
Alt-Right and This.
U.S. Nationalist Front
National Socialist Party of America
Aryan Nations (Years active: 1970-present)

Aryan Nations is an anti-semitic, neo-Nazi,[1] white supremacist[2] terrorist organization that was originally based in Hayden, Idaho. Richard Girnt Butler founded the group in the 1970s, as an arm of the Christian Identity organization Church of Jesus Christ?Christian. The Federal Bureau of Investigation has called Aryan Nations a "terrorist threat",[3] and the RAND Corporation has called it the "first truly nationwide terrorist network" in the United States.[4]

Meanwhile, the Communist Party USA has a measly 5,000 members and a single, solitary, lonesome local official in "power".
 

Axiomatic

New member
Nyvis said:
Yeah why be a Nazi and bring all that baggage when you could be a clerical fascist!

Obviously it isn't as universal as we would like or hope, but I really think the average American has a certain disdain for Nazis. There's still enough media about heroic GI's blowing up Panzers in France's hedgerows that just openly waving a swastika around is going to turn off more people than it turns on.

But take the same murderous psychopathy, sadistic self-righteousness and antisemitism, and call it JESUS? NOW you're talking American!

Christian Identity has the added benefit of having the perfect excuse for its antisemitism - you don't actually hate jews because anglo-saxons are the real jews, the actual descendants of Abraham, whereas the people calling themselves jews today are actually just Turks who converted to judaism in order to try and steal god's favor from white people.
 
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