2020 elections thread

Aaron Fox

Member
Don't Democrats control the house? What exactly have they even done with that?
They've done nothing and are all out of ideas.
Because, if you took your US Civics properly, the House is only half of Congress and the weaker half of Congress at that. There is only so much you can do with limited capabilities.

The Senate is the more powerful house of the two.
I bailed on the Liberals when it became clear that they were the exact same as the conservative reactionaries.

Same sexism, same rape apologia, same racism, same conspiracy nonsense. There's literally no difference.

Hell, considering that Larry "Literally has the blood of millions on his hands" Summers is Biden's economic advisor, it might actually cause less damage for Trump to win if that's the calibre of person Biden is bringing to the party.
Wow, this level of 'what did I just read' that I haven't seen in a while. You forget that the Democrats are a coalition, a coalition of essentially 'everyone not batshit crazy like the GOP' (that and conveniently forget that in the US, practically all Third Parties are made up of all sorts of crazy in the political sense). If you can't see that, then politically you're so far lost that you can't even use a map, a compass, and a guide to get back where you started.

You keep thinking and saying one thing while conveniently forgetting the contexts in play.
 

Nyvis

Active member
Because, if you took your US Civics properly, the House is only half of Congress and the weaker half of Congress at that. There is only so much you can do with limited capabilities.

The Senate is the more powerful house of the two.

Not on policy, no. The Senate may have more powers on judiciary appointments, but the house has more power on budget.

Wow, this level of 'what did I just read' that I haven't seen in a while. You forget that the Democrats are a coalition, a coalition of essentially 'everyone not batshit crazy like the GOP' (that and conveniently forget that in the US, practically all Third Parties are made up of all sorts of crazy in the political sense). If you can't see that, then politically you're so far lost that you can't even use a map, a compass, and a guide to get back where you started.

You keep thinking and saying one thing while conveniently forgetting the contexts in play.

You have offered zero counterpoint to the actual accusations made. Sure, the democrats are a big tent, which is why they have all kind of different problems. But that doesn't change the fact that they don't really care much about their candidates' racism, their defense of Biden over the sex assault accusation are textbook from the Kavanaugh playbook of going after the victim's credibility with the kitchen sink, they're prone to accusing anything not going their way of being Russian assets and Sumner is in fact Biden's economic advisor.

The big tent may explain how they end up there, but can't excuse it when a lot of those issues aren't the fringes of the party.
 

Aaron Fox

Member
Not on policy, no. The Senate may have more powers on judiciary appointments, but the house has more power on budget.
However, that isn't as complete as you would want it to be, this power is shared with the Senate.
You have offered zero counterpoint to the actual accusations made. Sure, the democrats are a big tent, which is why they have all kind of different problems. But that doesn't change the fact that they don't really care much about their candidates' racism, their defense of Biden over the sex assault accusation are textbook from the Kavanaugh playbook of going after the victim's credibility with the kitchen sink, they're prone to accusing anything not going their way of being Russian assets and Sumner is in fact Biden's economic advisor.

The big tent may explain how they end up there, but can't excuse it when a lot of those issues aren't the fringes of the party.
The thing is you are looking at it through a lens that thinks anything not radical race equality as racist and that Machiavelli is an idiot (and, let's be honest, he and Hobbes are far more right than we want to give them credit for). The Dems have successfully improved race relations not on revolution/radical thought but by building it comparatively slowly. Hence the Washington Post article about the Dem Establishment that I posted earlier.

Yes, sometimes things went ways that they didn't expect -that's why they're called 'unexpected consequences'- but it is far more solid than simply going straight radical.
 

Nyvis

Active member
The thing is you are looking at it through a lens that thinks anything not radical race equality as racist and that Machiavelli is an idiot (and, let's be honest, he and Hobbes are far more right than we want to give them credit for). The Dems have successfully improved race relations not on revolution/radical thought but by building it comparatively slowly. Hence the Washington Post article about the Dem Establishment that I posted earlier.

Yes, sometimes things went ways that they didn't expect -that's why they're called 'unexpected consequences'- but it is far more solid than simply going straight radical.

I love how you picked up only one of the elements and are now ignoring all the others.

Yes, they've done some progress on race issues. I'm not sure how far they're willing to do before they stop. I'd really like to hear more about fixing problems with policing and electing Biden with his past of tough on crime is unlikely to move that along significantly. But yes, they've done some things. It's not quick enough and people regularly die because it hasn't reached them yet but it's something.

This doesn't address any of the other issues though.
 

Aaron Fox

Member
I love how you picked up only one of the elements and are now ignoring all the others.

Yes, they've done some progress on race issues. I'm not sure how far they're willing to do before they stop. I'd really like to hear more about fixing problems with policing and electing Biden with his past of tough on crime is unlikely to move that along significantly. But yes, they've done some things. It's not quick enough and people regularly die because it hasn't reached them yet but it's something.

This doesn't address any of the other issues though.
I ignored the 'Russia' comment because let's face it, it's loaded no matter where you go. You'll get dogpiled by people no matter where you go. I'm of the camp of "the scant public evidence speaks for itself, but since one party decides to ignore it we can't do much".

As Bismark said, "Politics is the art of the possible". We can't go all revolution because most people don't want a revolution. The biggest reason that 'Obamacare' has succeeded is that it lasted long enough for people to get used to it and thus it made it harder to get rid of. You have to look at the general situation with both eyes open as it were, not doing so will only cause problems.
 

Nyvis

Active member
I ignored the 'Russia' comment because let's face it, it's loaded no matter where you go. You'll get dogpiled by people no matter where you go. I'm of the camp of "the scant public evidence speaks for itself, but since one party decides to ignore it we can't do much".

As Bismark said, "Politics is the art of the possible". We can't go all revolution because most people don't want a revolution. The biggest reason that 'Obamacare' has succeeded is that it lasted long enough for people to get used to it and thus it made it harder to get rid of. You have to look at the general situation with both eyes open as it were, not doing so will only cause problems.

The Russia thing isn't about whether they were involved with Trump in 2016. It's pretty clear they were. It's about the average democrats using it as an excuse for everything and against everyone. Don't like criticism on the internet? Must be Russian trolls. Sex assault accusations? Must be Russian trolls. People dare to vote for 3rd parties because you're not doing your job of appealing to them? Must be Russian trolls.

As for the rest... Bismarck was a reactionary. Of course, he'd think that and want you to think that too.

The population isn't a natural disaster you have to ride, it's a bunch of humans you can convince of things if you're willing to work for it. Sure, look at things with open eyes. But also without your arms bound behind your back. Which is exactly what the democrats' style of technocratic poll based policy selection is doing.

All gains aren't equal. You have to think about what can actually build worker power so that they can defend their gains in turn, and what doesn't. Of course, the democrats don't care about that. Because this isn't just a disagreement on means, it's a disagreement on goals, and anyone telling you otherwise is plain just lying.
 
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As Bismark said, "Politics is the art of the possible". We can't go all revolution because most people don't want a revolution. The biggest reason that 'Obamacare' has succeeded is that it lasted long enough for people to get used to it and thus it made it harder to get rid of. You have to look at the general situation with both eyes open as it were, not doing so will only cause problems.
Don't know why you're quoting Bismark, name dropping Machiavelli and Hobbes, when you should just be quoting Macron, the people's champion of "I am an empty suit and offer you nothing but at least I'm not the literal fascist". That seems like a more accurate reflection of the political foundation Biden and the Democratic Party were built upon.
 

Rise Comics

Site Artist
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Honestly, even if Biden is winning atm, I’m just too stressed out from the Elections atm. But I can’t stop watching this train wreck of an election cycle fall apart in real time.
 

Alpha

New member
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They/them
Either way were fucked, y'all seen the trump memo thing? Guys actively supporting paramilitary action from his supporters. Remember when he said standby in the debate? He knew this would happen; he knew he would lose so he's gonna try to take it by force.
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Solarstream

Alchemic Anarchist
Pronouns
he/him
any bets on how long trump is going to keep going with these nonsense legal challenges? it looks like he's running out of steam.
 
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